Is car safety technology replacing common sense?

Unsure as I am about which NG you are replying to, I congratulate you on
being one voice of sanity....

Auto makers are desparately trying to reduce their exposure to frivilous
lawsuits and are introducing "vehicle dynamic systems"..... Small wonder in
a society where people don't expect a cup of coffee to be "hot".

Many years ago, I spent insufficient time trying to learn how to be a good
race driver... I learned a lot - but, since you aren't watching me Sunday
afternoon - earning a whole whack of money for going real fast and turning
left - I didn't make it. But I did come away with a better than average idea
of vehicle dynamics and the physics implicated....

I welcome my ABS.... I don't have to spend time modulating brake pressure...
Interestingly, if I did modulate my brake pressure right - my ABS would
never cycle....

I recently purchased an 05 Mustang for my loving bride.... This car has a
traction control system. If I wanted to be an abject idiot, this system has
the possibilty of changing my day.... If I use my head, the system enhances
my driving experience....

Electronic controls will never mitigate "stupid"..... but they go a long way
to keeping "ooops" from happening....

 

The one you trimmed out:

The clear case where the manufacturers have done nothing to address a
safety defect in their ABS systems since the fix would probably increase
the manufacturing cost $10 for the additional sensor needed to detect
the fault condition.

 

IMO

As well as I think the biggest benefit of these technologies is for those
drivers who are less skilled than they think they are, which so far as I can
tell, make up a all of the drivers on the road.

HTN

 

The system can be only as good as the people who design it. I remember when
ABS braking first came out they put them on commercial trucks first
(mandated by Federal Law) and more than a few good drivers lost their lifes
because of a flawed braking system. It got so bad that one State even went
against the Feds and Ban the Trucks with the ABS system.... the brakes were
releasing and guys just couldn't get stopped or the brakes wouldn't release
at all and the driver would miss a few days of work while they tried to get
his truck to move out of the parking lot. A few years later, after the
'bugs' were supposedly worked out, they started putting them on cars. That
computer sensory stuff is dangerous. It might be just dandy if everything is
working OK, but eventually it will malfunction and it could cost you your
life. (just like airbags were killing short people & children when they
first came out). That crap is why your $5000 plastic car sells for $30000.

 

Usually when the ABS system detects a problem, it deactivates itself, and
you have standard brakes.

 

Have had ABS for years. No problems.

DAS

For direct replies replace nospam with schmetterling
---

 

It seems my safe driving record will be equalled by some fool in a modern
car with out a clue of any drivng skills .Loud music texting arguing
speeding no worries the technoledgy will compensate just like spell checkers
eh?

 

Well, if that is the case then what you might want to do is start
driving something very simple with no safety features, mechanical
brakes and a touring top. Have fun....

 

But was the reason you needed to swerve in the first place a result of
following too close or driving too fast for the conditions? I'd
actually rather let stupid drivers get hurt instead of have their
vehicle rescue their clumsy ass.

 

Seems like the easier, cheaper and safer solution is to make it harder
to get a driver's license, and easier for incompetent drivers to lose
their license. The tolerance most states have for bad driving is
unbelievable, especially in the southwest (California with it's
complete lack of ability to enforce it's license requirements, Arizona
with effectively permanent licenses...).

Just retest everybody every time their license renewal comes up,
regardless of age or driving record. And make drivers licenses expire
at least as often as registration tags, if not sooner.

 

Actually, I will. I have a tendancy to pull in too close ahead of
people hiding in my blind spot due to lack of windows other than the
windshield and cab doors on my Tradesman (though I would argue that
the other driver is a co-moron to such an incident for hiding in an
obviously blind spot of a large vehicle). The blind spot eliminator
fisheye is also no help when the co-moron is driving a highway-colored
vehicle (tan, grey, silver, white, black and similar colors) and is
not driving with their lights on, especially under conditions they're
required to be lit up anyway (in tunnels, driving in the rain or fog,
on roads with poor visibility, etc). Pretty much have to drive as a
two-man crew to avoid the problem.

 

That might not entirely be a bad thing if it means we get a functional
transportation infrastructure that isn't so mismanaged that the only
possible tools for many jobs are expensive (for the average household)
airline tickets and personal cars. Pretty much the rest of the first
world, even over geographically large, population sparse areas tend to
have better mass transit than you will find in most North American
cities (and pretty much all but New York, Seattle and Portland in the
US).

I think airbags could be cost justified if the steering wheel airbag
was replaced with a steel pike by mandate. If collisions resulted in
gauranteed death to the driver, that might just provide enough
incentive to make bad drivers and Californians learn what they're
doing before they get behind the wheel.

 

How often does one see adults at school bus stops after the first week
of school? Seems like any parent who is going to take enough time out
of their morning to wait for the bus with their kids is just going to
drive them in themselves anyway...

 

Along those same lines, I have a real hard time with people who are
pissed off about terrorism but think Daylight Savings Time is a good
thing, given that on an average year, DST kills about 6000 Americans
on US highways per year due to fatigue resulting from needlessly
screwing with people's sleep, and terrorism, on it's worst year, kills
about 3000 Americans.

I'd rather have the safety-device overdependant, and the God's Gift to
Tires types both did not have driver's licenses.

http://learn.to/quote please...

 

Wait, there's brakes that aren't fundamentally mechanical? How the
hell do those work, given what it's trying to stop is mechanical?

 

So the stupid driver swerves and also takes out your mother, wife, and lazy
brother in law, but if the stupid driver is killed too, you'd rejoice?
Brilliant thinking.

 

IMO there's a difference between real safety equipment and nanny-isms.

Take lawnmowers for example: deflectors and shields that prevent the
mower from throwing a rock straight in the operators face are real,
practical, valid safety devices and have been around since the 50s.

Blade brakes and "dead man" switches, on the other hand, are
nanny-devices that replace the common sense skills that I was taught by
age 10: "Don't stick your hand under a running mower, and turn it off if
you walk away from it."


In the same vein, brake/gearshift interlocks on cars are nanny devices
that replace the common-sense training of "put your damn foot on the
brake when you shift into gear unless you are 100% ready for the car to
move."

 

I was thinking more of devices like ABS, seat belts, dual braking
system, disc brakes, air bags, safety glass, improved suspensions,
improved tires, etc. But yes it is also a good idea to have a car
that can't be started unless it is in park and the foot is on the
brake. I wish we didn't have to design cars for the lowest common
denominator, but we do.

 

Most automotive brakes are hydra-mechanical but the name is
abbreviated to hydraulic. I was speaking of mechanical brakes
actuated with with rods connected to a pedal.

 

And here was I thinking that the '"dead man" switch' was to make sure
that the self-propelled mower, snow thrower, etc., wouldn't just keep
charging ahead if the operator slipped and fell or actually even dropped
dead. How silly of me!

Perce