New XC70/90 - A friend queried me....

  • Thread starter Thread starter Henry
  • Start date Start date
H

Henry

A fellow I work with is considering one of the above referenced vehicles.
He knows I drive Volvo's (240,740, current '96 850 turbo) and asked my
opinion of the new SUV.
I told him basically I would ask for a "peer review" on the net here at
a.a.v but that much of the knowledge passed around here was sort of
historical in nature. After all, who can predict the reliability or safety
of a new model?
Nevertheless if you've any opinions you feel sound about, pass them along,
with my thanks and I will do the same.
Henry
 
A family I know (friends with the daughter) have a V70, basically the same
engine and technology as in the XC70, minus an AWD system, and different
styling. 130K Kms on this 2001 model (could be a 2000... its the oldest year
of the new style), and no mechanical failures. Brake sensor/DSTC system had
to be replaced at owners expense due to failure... They think the garage
damaged the computer, because they put in a new "rear end controller" that
didn't work properly with the car, then updated the software from the
mainframe in Sweden after installing a new module.... After that they got
weird computer and sensor problems, all is well tho.... $6000 in total
repairs for maintenance and replacement of parts, I don't think it is
realistic to expect a DSTC failure from a new one tho, my dealer and their
dealer told me and them that they have all the bugs worked out, and that the
01 models (first model year) did in fact have a couple issues that had to be
sorted, mostly with software updates to the plethora of onboard computers

Basically they were so happy with the car they bought it off lease, and put
the money into it for whatever it needed. They really love the car, but need
a bit more space right now, so they are looking at other cars, none they
have looked at have been able to match their Volvo for desireability and
apparant quality. They didn't like the XC90 they test drove... and it was
too much money (T6).

Basically
 
Henry said:
Nevertheless if you've any opinions you feel sound about, pass them along,
with my thanks and I will do the same.
Click to expand...

One thing to think about, if money is a factor, is that the XC90 is
Volvo's top-seller. That means that the buyer is not likely to get any
discounts on pricing: around this part of the country, they are going
for MSRP, and there are no incentives like dealer cash or rebates.

The XC70, on the other hand, has seen its sales slow. The general
consensus appears to be that many of the XC70 buyers have jumped on the
XC90 bandwagon. Right now, Volvo is offering dealer cash on the XC70
and you can probably get it for a few hundred under MSRP as well.

That being said, the XC90 is a true SUV and the XC70 sits in that sorta
"middle ground". They are both nice cars, and all things being equal,
it comes down to personal preference. The XC90 is a bit pricier to
insure (though cheap for an SUV!) and gets slightly lower gas mileage,
so it's got a higher ownership cost, but that might not be a big issue
for a lot of people.


Cheers,
-+JLS
 
Henry said:
Nevertheless if you've any opinions you feel sound about, pass them along,
with my thanks and I will do the same.
Click to expand...

The V70XC was significantly redesigned in '01 and has proven to be a
good car with good reliability.

The XC90 is a new car and is highly rated but has yet to prove its long
term reliability.
 
Based on the very long list of problems with all the Vord/Volvos
produced since 1999, I expect the XC90 to have it's share of problems.

Btw, the best SUV on the planet is the Porsche Cayenne. I test drove
one over 5 hours in the city and in the wood.

Tell your friend to try one. You get for every cent you pay. That's
not the case with today's Volvo cars.

And don't forget that the Volvo dealers offer a level of service often
below what is deemed "excellent" or even good. The root of the
problem is that Volvo HQ is more concerned about its dealers, than the
customers.
 
Patrick said:
And don't forget that the Volvo dealers offer a level of service often
below what is deemed "excellent" or even good. The root of the
problem is that Volvo HQ is more concerned about its dealers, than the
customers.
Click to expand...

Volvo is working hard to fix that. They give the dealers that have good
customer satisfaction on service a discount on their new cars. That is
one of my pet peeves, I don't like customer surveys. I hate them.

We have 4 Volvo dealers near where I live. 2 are excellent. 2 are
horrible. It is like everything else, you have to look for a good dealer
and then find a car you like. If you do it the other way, you are
likely to be disappointed. There are a lot of people that complain
about their car because they chose a bad dealer. There are very few
people who complain about their car if they have a good dealer.
 
Funny, my dealer said XC70 sales have increased slightly as more people get
the buzz about the XC90, walk into the showroom and realize the XC70 would
do a better job for their needs. In a sales report I read the XC70 was said
to be holding its own against the XC90.
 
Patrick (and others),

Would the VW Touareg share your same accolades?

Jim Kelly


| Based on the very long list of problems with all the Vord/Volvos
| produced since 1999, I expect the XC90 to have it's share of
problems.
|
| Btw, the best SUV on the planet is the Porsche Cayenne. I test
drove
| one over 5 hours in the city and in the wood.
|
| Tell your friend to try one. You get for every cent you pay.
That's
| not the case with today's Volvo cars.
|
| And don't forget that the Volvo dealers offer a level of service
often
| below what is deemed "excellent" or even good. The root of the
| problem is that Volvo HQ is more concerned about its dealers, than
the
| customers.
|
| On Tue, 03 Feb 2004 18:17:17 -0500, Henry <[email protected]>
wrote:
|
| >
| >A fellow I work with is considering one of the above referenced
vehicles.
| >He knows I drive Volvo's (240,740, current '96 850 turbo) and
asked my
| >opinion of the new SUV.
| >I told him basically I would ask for a "peer review" on the net
here at
| >a.a.v but that much of the knowledge passed around here was sort
of
| >historical in nature. After all, who can predict the reliability
or safety
| >of a new model?
| >Nevertheless if you've any opinions you feel sound about, pass
them along,
| >with my thanks and I will do the same.
| > Henry
|
 
I'd say so.... Checked one out when I was with my dad buying his new 2003
Golf CL (absolute base model, good commuter car... has Volvo-like safety
gear, and good reliability) and those things are phenomenal. Takes the seats
from a Volvo and put it into the Touareg and it would be prefect!... It's
quite a bit nicer then the XC90.
 
Sorry, I don't have enough knowledge as well as real life experience
to provide a valid judgement.
 
Rob Guenther said:
Funny, my dealer said XC70 sales have increased slightly as more people get
the buzz about the XC90, walk into the showroom and realize the XC70 would
do a better job for their needs. In a sales report I read the XC70 was said
to be holding its own against the XC90.
Click to expand...

I suppose one could consider a 17% decline in sales to be "holding its
own", but there's no way it can be considered a slight increase. Now,
the sales may have dropped like a stone and then started creeping back
up, but XC70 sales in the US have definitely been off in '03 compared
to '02. Check out:

http://www.swedespeed.com/old_site/news/10_03/10_01_03/index.shtml

Personally, I never believe anything a dealer tells me about sales
figures. Remember, they are trying to sell cars. The "top selling"
car, or the "best value" car, or the "best peforming" car is always the
car you are buying.

The real truth is to be found in the incentives. There are no incentives
on the XC90 because they don't need them: sales are strong at MSRP. You
don't offer incentives on cars that are selling at or above expections.


Cheers,
-+JLS
 
Stephen M. Henning said:
Volvo is working hard to fix that. They give the dealers that have good
customer satisfaction on service a discount on their new cars. That is
one of my pet peeves, I don't like customer surveys. I hate them.

We have 4 Volvo dealers near where I live. 2 are excellent. 2 are
horrible. It is like everything else, you have to look for a good dealer
and then find a car you like. If you do it the other way, you are
likely to be disappointed. There are a lot of people that complain
about their car because they chose a bad dealer. There are very few
people who complain about their car if they have a good dealer.
Click to expand...

Volvo has had the program where dealers get rebates for good survey
scores since the early '90s. If this was going to work as implemented,
it would have worked by now. Maybe it's worked on some dealers and not
others. You're lucky to have a varied choice of dealers local to you,
not everybody is so lucky. Maybe Volvo USA is a little more customer
friendly than Volvo Canada. When I had dealings with a crappy dealer
and on to Volvo Canada for resolution, the impression I got from
everybody I dealt with at Volvo Canada was not that they wanted me to be
a happy customer, just that they wanted to do the minimum and get me to
shut up and go away. And the most hilarious part of the story, while I
was showing them all the mistakes they made, the service manager was
trying to get me to bring my car there for its regular services!

--
Mike F.
Thornhill (near Toronto), Ont.

NOTE: new address!!
Replace tt with t (twice!) and remove parentheses to email me directly.
(But I check the newsgroup more often than this email address.)
 
In talking with many people, some working for Volvo dealerships and
others ... , I came to the realization that Volvo HQ (VCNA) is there
to support the dealers, first and foremost.

I cannot explain it to myself, but Volvo HQ is definitely biased
AGAINST the customers who buy Volvo cars.

For that reason alone, one should question the wisdom of buying a
product not supported by the manufacturer itself. In particular when
it is a major purchase for most people.

Add to that the unreliability of Volvo dealers and you really have to
be "courageous" to go ahead with such purchase. In my case, it won't
be an issue, unless there are major philosophical changes at Volvo.
 
Not all the initial problems have been ironed out of the new XC90 but there getting there. The XC70 is a good solid car and few problems are reported, My advice wait till later in 2004 To purchase an XC90

Cheers
 
Well i'm going off of Canadian sales, not American.

I believed the salesman, he knew I was in the dealership with my parents car
(93' 960) picking it up for service. I was just browsing around and making
small talk with him, he didn't seem to be BSing me about anything, and was
certainly not trying to sell me anything.

He could have just been talking about his dealership as well, didn't mention
that specific.
 
Patrick said:
In talking with many people, some working for Volvo dealerships and
others ... , I came to the realization that Volvo HQ (VCNA) is there
to support the dealers, first and foremost.

I cannot explain it to myself, but Volvo HQ is definitely biased
AGAINST the customers who buy Volvo cars.

For that reason alone, one should question the wisdom of buying a
product not supported by the manufacturer itself. In particular when
it is a major purchase for most people.

Add to that the unreliability of Volvo dealers and you really have to
be "courageous" to go ahead with such purchase. In my case, it won't
be an issue, unless there are major philosophical changes at Volvo.
Click to expand...

My impression was that Volvo Canada HQ didn't care about me or the
dealer. They only seemed to care about keeping their short term
warranty expensed down. And interestingly I was surveyed after the
whole thing was over, asking what I thought of Volvo Canada's customer
service!

--
Mike F.
Thornhill (near Toronto), Ont.

NOTE: new address!!
Replace tt with t (twice!) and remove parentheses to email me directly.
(But I check the newsgroup more often than this email address.)
 
Patrick said:
In talking with many people, some working for Volvo dealerships and
others ... , I came to the realization that Volvo HQ (VCNA) is there
to support the dealers, first and foremost.
I cannot explain it to myself, but Volvo HQ is definitely biased
AGAINST the customers who buy Volvo cars.
Click to expand...

It is very simple. If you find a dealer that is in the business to stay
in the business, you have a customer oriented dealer. Then, if they are
a Volvo dealer, you know that they are strongly supported by VCNA. It
is a strong combination.

If you find a lousy dealer, VCNA will not make them good, they will just
cut them off if they are bad enough. Usually a bad dealer will shield
you from VCNA so they don't find out how bad they are. There is a VCNA
rep that comes out to dealerships to talk to customers and fix customer
complaints. A bad dealer will isolate you from this person.
 
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