No start under 5 degrees C - '88 240.

Discussion in 'Volvo 240' started by Richard Bouchard, Nov 17, 2003.

  1. Group, I'm throwing this bottle! (more like a barrel...)

    I have a '88 240 wagon with 340,000 kms. It runs like a charm. So well
    in fact, that last month we were "that" close to buying a 2001 V40 - we
    even had left a deposit with the dealer - but changed our mind because
    it wasn't as smooth as this one. Of course, with this mileage, from time
    to time I have to change a few parts, but nothing major, just a little
    annoying when things break without notice...

    The only ungoing problem I've had with this car for the last two years
    is that it doesn't want to start when the temperature drops below 5 -10
    degrees C. Let's have a look at the story so far:

    The first winter I had the car, five years ago, I killed the battery,
    but it was aged and needed being replaced anyway. Then I had to replace
    it again last year. This time, I got the most powerful one available.
    The mechanic at the shop I went to (Canadian Tire - a large chain I
    don't trust but I went there thinking my previous battery would still be
    under warranty) found nothing wrong with the charging system, which I
    found reassuring since I suspect this sort of place to tend to trick you
    into uneeded repairs.

    Anyway, I have this year a lot of cranking power but the car still won't
    start under 5, unless I plug in the block heater I had installed last
    year all night. When it's under 0 C (32 F) though, I have to crank it
    for 2 -3 minutes before it starts stumbling, even if it had been
    plugged. I had the starter rebuilt a couple of months ago, and it won't
    last long, I'm afraid. And this is nothing like it is going to be in the
    very cold of winter!

    When I got the car, it had "only" 260,000 kms on it and it was starting
    at the first turn of key (at the quarter of a turn, as we say). Only the
    battery went bad. After I changed the battery everything was OK for the
    rest of that winter. The following year, I experienced something else:
    Every now and then, while I was driving, engine would begin to stumble
    and lose power when I tempted to accelerate after a stop, but it would
    never stall. I only had to turn it of and start again and it would be
    fine! This lasted a couple years until one day, while I was dismantling
    the intake manifold to clean the air filter, I discovered that two hoses
    had cracks in them. I cut off the damaged end and I never experienced
    that problem again. Only, my engine nedded now three or four turns or
    more before it would fire up... It didn't worry me too much, though. But
    that seems to have been a turning point of sort.

    Every winter or so since then, I had to call the Auto Club for a boost
    at least 4 or 5 times. With my new battery, as I said, I have lots of
    power, but it won't last, I fear.

    Then, at the end of last winter, the car died on a red light. I had it
    towed home and I spent a week trying to figure it out: I already had the
    new battery, so I replaced also the plugs and wires, the distributor and
    the coil, and I diagnosed nothing wrong with the cold start valve, the
    O2 sensor, the coolant temp sensor, the throttle switch, the air mass
    meter as well as the knock sensor - I checked everything I was able to,
    according to the readings in my Haynes. For the first time in four years
    I resolved to have my car towed to the garage, where they found after
    an hour that the EFI module was faulty. I had it replaced for a used one
    - new ones sold for a mere $1,200 - and I was back on the road. But my
    problem wasn't fixed. In the spring and summer there's nothing I can do
    about it, since there's no symptom.

    With the problem resurfacing again last month and being determined to
    get rid of it - the problem, not the car - I took it in for a routine
    check and mentionned the case. The mechanic at this Volvo only
    independent shop examined the fuel system and quickly diagnosed a failed
    check valve. He replaced it. That was last week. Problem is still there.
    I called another independent shop and they told me it might be the LH
    Jetronic ECU. I almost fainted. I don't want to go through this trial
    and error process!

    So far: Where should I look? Fuel pressure is apparently good, so must I
    assume the whole fuel system is OK? The EFI should now be all right. The
    electrical, I don't know... It seems so intricate that I'm a little
    lost. I've read a lot of posts about it and I feel it might just be a
    short ground somewhere or something like it. How can I find it myself?
    If I take it in for a full electrical check-in, I'm afraid it'll cost me
    a bundle.

    Oh, the symptoms: When cold, I have to crank it for 2-3 minutes or more
    before it begins to stumble. When it finally fires, it is VERY rough, as
    if only two out of four cylinders had fire. The engine almost jumps out
    of the bay and it stinks. It hesitates for 20-30 seconds then it picks
    up. After that, if I run it regularly during the day and don't let it
    cool off completely, it is fine.

    1988 240DL Wagon
    Engine : B230F
    Jetronics : 2.2

    That's about it. Group, you're my last hope...

    Thanks in advanve!

    Richard Bouchard.
     
    Richard Bouchard, Nov 17, 2003
    #1
  2. Richard Bouchard

    Jim Carriere Guest

    It sounds like you've been very thorough so far, and really know your stuff-
    too bad you're still stuck.

    Here is a thought- are you sure your cold start injector is working
    properly? I mean, is it getting voltage to open, and does fuel actually
    come out of it?

    I'm not too familiar with that FI system, I went from SUs to Motronic :) and
    I know that not all model years had a cold start injector. IIRC the EFI
    computer reads the coolant temperature and commands the cold start injector
    to spray each time you start up for a certain duration (between a few to
    several seconds depending on how cold).

    Hope this helps...
     
    Jim Carriere, Nov 17, 2003
    #2
  3. Richard Bouchard

    Tim.. Guest


    The Bosch CIS system really is pretty fool proof- it works pretty well 99%
    of the time. You seem to have been through it fairly conprehensively.
    Failure to start at low temperatures, can only really be due to 2 things.
    Either the cold start injector isnt firing, or the control pressure is too
    high leading to a weak mixture. You dont mention poor running during warm-up
    which would be indicative of a faulty warm up reg (hence incorrect control
    pressure) so that leaves us the cold start injector. You have established
    there is power to it- but is fuel actually coming out?? Fairly easy job to
    pull the injector, point towards a can and on a cold morning crank it over
    and look for fuel spraying.

    Tim..
     
    Tim.., Nov 18, 2003
    #3
  4. Richard Bouchard

    Herman Guest

    are you using any "gasoline treatment" ????, there may be "water" in
    your fuel system, and this will cause problems at "cold" temps.
    (Just a thought, & cheap to try!!!)
    Herman, '83 282 5.0 H.O., formerly 242 Turbo intercooled.
     
    Herman, Nov 18, 2003
    #4
  5. Hi all,

    Cold start valve was my best guess when I took it to the repair shop,
    but I assumed it was OK after the mechanic checked (so he said anyway)
    the fuel pressure and diagnosed a bad check valve. Of course the engine
    was warm at that point... I should have them check it further, or do it
    myself following the procedure you suggest, I guess.

    By the way, isn't LH 2.* (Jetronic) completly different from CIS?

    Also, I should mention that a month ago I went to a smog check clinic
    (we don't have mandatory smog check here) and my car gave outstanding
    results - both HC and CO2 emissions were way below what's expected for
    new cars! But of course, the engine was warm.

    Thanks for your input, it seems to narrow it down to what I suspected.
    I'll keep you all posted!

    "Tim.." a écrit :
     
    Richard Bouchard, Nov 18, 2003
    #5
  6. Richard Bouchard

    James Sweet Guest

    Hi all,

    Cold start valve was my best guess when I took it to the repair shop,
    but I assumed it was OK after the mechanic checked (so he said anyway)
    the fuel pressure and diagnosed a bad check valve. Of course the engine
    was warm at that point... I should have them check it further, or do it
    myself following the procedure you suggest, I guess.

    By the way, isn't LH 2.* (Jetronic) completly different from CIS?


    Yes, CIS is mechanical, LH is fully computerized, more to go wrong with LH,
    but in my experience it's easier to diagnose and runs better all around.
     
    James Sweet, Nov 18, 2003
    #6
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