s60 vs. BMW?

[Benjamin Smith]

A great list of alternatives Paul. The S60 simply does not cut it
against the current crop of competing vehicles, which probably has a lot
to do with it's poor sales of late and crummy resale value.

Volvo made a big mistake when they replaced the 850/S70 with a smaller
interior vehicle. I was shopping a few years ago to replace my '96 850
and found the rear seat legroom of the S60 to be completely unacceptable
for full sized adults on a long drive. The S60 styling also gave up a
great deal of interior functionality in order to do the heavy curved
roof line and sculptured sides look. Appearance over capability is not
what the Volvo brand used to mean at all. Remember "form follows
function". Volvo has intentionally forgotten that mantra.

The s60 is a way better car than the s70 in terms of ride refinement and
body structure and also aerodynamics and to a large degree dynamic
qualities (handling, braking, etc.). It was a hot seller for a long time
and is has been a success for Volvo. Volvo owners were asking for less
boxy cars and the s60 is considered stylish, arguably Volvo's best
looking car. True, it has a terrible turning circle and compromised
interior space and visibility. Form follows function no longer applies
in the European auto world. Mercedes CLS could not have been built in
the 80s with its ridiculous small side windows and sunken-in feeling
interior. I think it is truly ugly, reminds of the other hideous Daimler
-Benz product, the Chrysler 300. I don't like the small windows and cut
off look yet the CLs is being called gorgeous and beautiful by just
about any reviewer reviewing it and plenty of its owners and the 300 is
absolutely popular. Both cars, IMO, have a disproportionate amount of
body vs. window area.

I think the s60 is a good car. It's a supremely comfortable car that is
due to be redesigned in 2008. Hopefully, Volvo will address its
shortcomings: poor rear room, blind spots and so-so visibility, terrible
turning circle--the major complaints about the s60.

Ben

 

[Benjamin Smith]

John...
Back in the fifties, when I first heard a radio commercial about Volvo
when my mother was driving me to school, (On the Dick Whittinghill show
in Los Angeles), and to the sixties to early seventies, Volvo used to
preach about the legroom and comfort because seven out of ten Swedes
were over six-feet tall. My, how things have changed. In Thailand a
few years ago, I met several Thai's who were over six feet due to
nutrition, and maybe a burgeoning middle class able to afford "Food".
But, Ford, who does not actually "Own" Volvo...they only have the
largest outstanding number of shares... has taken a different approach.
Ford wants to make more and more air-bags in smaller and smaller cars.
I'm waiting for an air-bag that goes up my ass for a prostate massage.

The s60 was *completely* designed by Volvo. Ford has nothing to do with
its style whatsoever nor its packaging. That was a Volvo decision as the
car was designed and finalized before Ford purchased Volvo.

Volvo cars from the s40 on may share with other Ford brands. But they
may be Mazda, Jaguar, or Rover.

Ben

 

[Benjamin Smith]

Kind of ironic since the RWD Volvos were famous for their tight turning
radii. Never ceases to amaze me how easily I can manipulate my big 740
in a tight parking garage.

Isn't it a shame. Tight turning circles used to be a selling point with
Volvo. My 760 turns tighter than my wife's considerably smaller s40 (by
about 3 feet).

Ben

 

[Benjamin Smith]

The point is that Volvo went to great engineering lengths to minimize
this on the 850 and kept the increase from the 240/740/940 to 850 at
only one foot (32.5 -> 33.5). Then on the S60 they blew out over
another another five feet to a final spec of 38.7 feet.

Is it because of the bigger tires? The s60 does hold the road well. It
may also has to do with how wide the car is vs. the overall length.

Ben

 

[Stephen Henning]

Is it because of the bigger tires? The s60 does hold the road well. It
may also has to do with how wide the car is vs. the overall length.

The S60 isn't any longer. Tire width is critical. The S60R has a 42.7
ft turning radius because of the tires. The S60T5 is only 39 ft.

 

[Paul_B]

The S60 isn't any longer. Tire width is critical. The S60R has a 42.7
ft turning radius because of the tires. The S60T5 is only 39 ft.

Thanks for that interesting bit of info. the R is now totally out
of consideration. 39' is quite bad enough; even it is almost a
deal-killer.

Paul